BD 231 Criss Cross

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Rayon Vert
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#26 Post by Rayon Vert » Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:04 pm

I have the Elephant Films version but was quite willing to double-dip on the MoC, in part because of the extras, but looking at the beaver review, the Shout and MoC sreenshots have a really waxy look to them and I much prefer the grainier Elephant. Anyone have the same opinion looking at these?

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tenia
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#27 Post by tenia » Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:16 pm

The Elephant disc is clearly sourced from an older typically looking Universal HD master which has noticeable EE. I guess that's why Gary went crazy trying to compare those, especially his laughable attempt at comparing the Shout and the Eureka (the Eureka having a better encode but not necessarily a "more robust" one), because in comparison, the newer master look softer.
I think the new one has been slightly grain managed but is more filmic looking, while the older only look sharper but is rather sharpened.

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Rayon Vert
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#28 Post by Rayon Vert » Sat Jul 04, 2020 4:35 pm

Thanks for your input tenia. The MoC hasn't been reviewed yet at blu-ray.com, but the review for the Shout version says this:
Appearing in its original exhibition ratio of around 1.37:1, Criss Cross looks very clean with excellent grayscale and inky blacks. This seems a most pleasing presentation but up until the scene at Union Depot in the middle of the film, the image is considerably de-grained. It appears a bit soft and doesn't have a thick texture that would make it look richly filmic. French label Elephant Films' Region B BD-25 has a lower encode and more scratches than Shout's (based on my research) but it retains the organic grain.
At this point I'm still inclined to stick with the Elephant.

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tenia
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#29 Post by tenia » Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:35 pm

Yes, that's what I talk about when saying some people are mixing up organic grain with thick and sharpened older masters with finer more recent ones that appear DNRed in comparison... While it's possible the newer restoration has been grain managed, the older disc doesnt show filmic organic grain at all.
(Nb : I reviewed the Elephant disc)

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willoneill
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#30 Post by willoneill » Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:07 pm

porquenegar wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:30 pm
Is anyone one else having a problem with viewing this on a region-free BD player? My player has never had a problem playing any of the 150+ MOC I own, but is having trouble with both Criss Cross and a Foreign Affair. It loads the disc, I hear the sound, I see the menu, I can navigate the menu with no issue, but when the movie itself starts playing, I get sound and no video. I pulled several other MOC Region 2 BD and they played with no issue. It seems odd that my player is only having problems with these most recent two discs.
I'm having the exact same issue with the Seven Chances disc of the Buster Keaton vol. 2 set (just that disc though, the other two are fine). I thought it was some weird glitch with my player because I couldn't find any indication online until tonight and your post.

I'll check Foreign Affair when it arrives.

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Rayon Vert
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#31 Post by Rayon Vert » Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:54 pm

tenia wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:35 pm
Yes, that's what I talk about when saying some people are mixing up organic grain with thick and sharpened older masters with finer more recent ones that appear DNRed in comparison... While it's possible the newer restoration has been grain managed, the older disc doesnt show filmic organic grain at all.
(Nb : I reviewed the Elephant disc)
OK, that clears it up more for me, thanks.

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porquenegar
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 7:33 pm

BD 231 Criss Cross

#32 Post by porquenegar » Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:06 pm

willoneill wrote:
porquenegar wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:30 pm
Is anyone one else having a problem with viewing this on a region-free BD player? My player has never had a problem playing any of the 150+ MOC I own, but is having trouble with both Criss Cross and a Foreign Affair. It loads the disc, I hear the sound, I see the menu, I can navigate the menu with no issue, but when the movie itself starts playing, I get sound and no video. I pulled several other MOC Region 2 BD and they played with no issue. It seems odd that my player is only having problems with these most recent two discs.
I'm having the exact same issue with the Seven Chances disc of the Buster Keaton vol. 2 set (just that disc though, the other two are fine). I thought it was some weird glitch with my player because I couldn't find any indication online until tonight and your post.

I'll check Foreign Affair when it arrives.
Hmm. I’m having this problem with my Oppo BDP-83 player but they both play fine on my Oppo BDP-103D player. I don’t have problems with any other of the MOC discs I’ve tried with either player.


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Florinaldo
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#33 Post by Florinaldo » Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:00 pm

porquenegar wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:30 pm
Is anyone one else having a problem with viewing this on a region-free BD player? My player has never had a problem playing any of the 150+ MOC I own, but is having trouble with both Criss Cross and a Foreign Affair. It loads the disc, I hear the sound, I see the menu, I can navigate the menu with no issue, but when the movie itself starts playing, I get sound and no video. I pulled several other MOC Region 2 BD and they played with no issue. It seems odd that my player is only having problems with these most recent two discs.
My copy of Criss Cross came in this week (it took twice as long as usual, as if Canada Post is imposing a quarantine on UK shipments :wink: ). I tested it on my Oppo 83 and got the same results you report. I then tried it on my Oppo 93, which is usually dedicated to region A, and it played just fine. I even got the Universal color lead, which was blank but with audio on the 83. I tried the disc on an LG player and it worked fine as well.

I also tested other recent MoC titles on my 83 and encountered no problem.

I assume then that there is an issue of compatibility between this specific disc's encoding and the firmware of the Oppo 83 (I have the last version released by the company, which has now ceased production of the machines). The problem may not be limited to this Oppo model, but others would have to check that.

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porquenegar
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Re: BD 231 Criss Cross

#34 Post by porquenegar » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:53 pm

That makes sense if we having the same problem with the same machine. Thanks for posting.

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